Trump is an ass, but he has a point. If your war is paid for by the US taxpayer, you are in no position to negotiate.
-- Edited by Maddog on Friday 28th of February 2025 09:10:06 PM
Barksdale said
Feb 28 9:45 PM, 2025
Maddog wrote:
Red Okktober wrote:
That meeting with Zelensky...
"You haven't once said thank you"
Great TV though.
Trump is an ass, but he has a point. If your war is paid for by the US taxpayer, you are in no position to negotiate.
-- Edited by Maddog on Friday 28th of February 2025 09:10:06 PM
I watched the build up to the argument again and you might have a point. I'm beginning to wonder if Zelenskky wanted an out for signing the minerals agreement and provoked an argument. Trump and Vance seemed to echo Putin talking points (and Vance lost his temper when Zelenskky mentioned that Putin had breached the 2015 ceasefire.) However, prior to that Zelenskky had been repeatedly taking shots about Russia / Putin's actions. If Trump and Vance are being honest brokers and seeking a peace deal (and I say this as someone who is highly suspicious of their motives) then all that would do is make a deal less likely as allowing it to slide would make them seem favourable to Ukraine.
What a shitshow.
Maddog said
Feb 28 10:27 PM, 2025
Barksdale wrote:
Maddog wrote:
Red Okktober wrote:
That meeting with Zelensky...
"You haven't once said thank you"
Great TV though.
Trump is an ass, but he has a point. If your war is paid for by the US taxpayer, you are in no position to negotiate.
-- Edited by Maddog on Friday 28th of February 2025 09:10:06 PM
I watched the build up to the argument again and you might have a point. I'm beginning to wonder if Zelenskky wanted an out for signing the minerals agreement and provoked an argument. Trump and Vance seemed to echo Putin talking points (and Vance lost his temper when Zelenskky mentioned that Putin had breached the 2015 ceasefire.) However, prior to that Zelenskky had been repeatedly taking shots about Russia / Putin's actions. If Trump and Vance are being honest brokers and seeking a peace deal (and I say this as someone who is highly suspicious of their motives) then all that would do is make a deal less likely as allowing it to slide would make them seem favourable to Ukraine.
What a shitshow.
It is a shit show, but this is how Trump negotiates.
I'd suggest no entity ever become dependent on him.
If Zelenskyy and Europe don't like this arrangement, they are free to go it on there own..
People are not used to a US president that gives zero fucks about anything that doesn't benefit the US, especially when we have a higher debt to GDP ratio than anyone in NATO save Greece and Italy..
Anonymous said
Mar 1 12:23 AM, 2025
The UK should cut ties with the US. An absolutely disgusting debacle with Zalensky.
The American people elected this imbecile. All those that voted for him are culpable with this Fascist Authoritarian madness.
What has the US brought to the world? Crap comedy. Bad food They are too loud and brash and mostly thick to put it mildly.
He's been invited for a state visit to the UK and just like the last time mass protests will plague his trip here as he polutes our soil the minute that he lands here.
The UK should cut ties with the US.
Not much that they could do about that.
Syl said
Mar 1 1:21 AM, 2025
Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:
Trump...the peacemaker. If anyone is going to start WW3....he's your man.
Watching the way he and his sidekick (who has never been near the Ukraine) bully Zelenskyy today, then have a hissy fit because Zelenskyy managed to say a few sentences, talking more sense in them than Trump managed all day...I can see this war escalating far further and wider than it has been.
What did Zelensky say that made sense for peace or for the US?
There can be no peace whilst Trump backs his friend Putin.
Trump repeatedly showed his knowledge of the Russia/Ukraine war was lacking, Vance jumped in, and when Zelensky asked respectfully to answer directly to Vance, who seemed to know less than Trump, Vance became defensive and insulting.
The two of them showed themselves up to be nasty bullies....speaking down to Zelenskyy as if they were headmaster and he was a child.
I doubt a world leader and his second in command have ever, in the history of TV, showed themselves up the way those two did.
As for the journalist who lowered the tone even further by criticising Zelenskies clothes, while Trump almost smirked...the whole event was a pathetic show of ignorance.
Anonymous said
Mar 1 9:48 AM, 2025
Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:
Trump...the peacemaker. If anyone is going to start WW3....he's your man.
Watching the way he and his sidekick (who has never been near the Ukraine) bully Zelenskyy today, then have a hissy fit because Zelenskyy managed to say a few sentences, talking more sense in them than Trump managed all day...I can see this war escalating far further and wider than it has been.
What did Zelensky say that made sense for peace or for the US?
There can be no peace whilst Trump backs his friend Putin.
Trump repeatedly showed his knowledge of the Russia/Ukraine war was lacking, Vance jumped in, and when Zelensky asked respectfully to answer directly to Vance, who seemed to know less than Trump, Vance became defensive and insulting.
The two of them showed themselves up to be nasty bullies....speaking down to Zelenskyy as if they were headmaster and he was a child.
I doubt a world leader and his second in command have ever, in the history of TV, showed themselves up the way those two did.
As for the journalist who lowered the tone even further by criticising Zelenskies clothes, while Trump almost smirked...the whole event was a pathetic show of ignorance.
Spot on, and Putin must have been rubbing his hands in delight when he saw it.
Vam said
Mar 1 12:03 PM, 2025
Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:
Trump...the peacemaker. If anyone is going to start WW3....he's your man.
Watching the way he and his sidekick (who has never been near the Ukraine) bully Zelenskyy today, then have a hissy fit because Zelenskyy managed to say a few sentences, talking more sense in them than Trump managed all day...I can see this war escalating far further and wider than it has been.
What did Zelensky say that made sense for peace or for the US?
There can be no peace whilst Trump backs his friend Putin.
Trump repeatedly showed his knowledge of the Russia/Ukraine war was lacking, Vance jumped in, and when Zelensky asked respectfully to answer directly to Vance, who seemed to know less than Trump, Vance became defensive and insulting.
The two of them showed themselves up to be nasty bullies....speaking down to Zelenskyy as if they were headmaster and he was a child.
I doubt a world leader and his second in command have ever, in the history of TV, showed themselves up the way those two did.
As for the journalist who lowered the tone even further by criticising Zelenskies clothes, while Trump almost smirked...the whole event was a pathetic show of ignorance.
I couldn’t like this post more! Every single word.
Vlad owns The Donald’s arse. Their unholy union started wayyyy back in the 80’s, when trump‘s properties/businesses were money-laundering Russian mob money. He‘ll be a Russian asset until he’s 6-feet under.
And as if yesterday’s Oval Office debacle wasn’t enough to prove his loyalty, it seems trump’s Defence Secretary - the former Fox weekend host/sexual abuser/functioning alcoholic - has ordered the US Cyber Command to stop monitoring/investigating Russian-related cybersecurity.
Just an extra little token of trump’s affection….‘knock yourself out, Vladimir!’
Vam said
Mar 1 12:25 PM, 2025
Syl: “ As for the journalist who lowered the tone even further by criticising Zelenskies clothes, while Trump almost smirked...the whole event was a pathetic show of ignorance.”
I’ve seen Zelenskyy in a suit, fwiw. He wears it verrry well and he makes 47 and his wingman, JD, look like a pair of crumpled trash bags by comparison.
For now, Zelenskyy’s clothes are symbolic of a WARTIME President. I see it as a sign of utmost respect of his people, and in recognition of what Ukrainians have had to so bravely endure at Putin’s hands.
Could someone help me understand how Zelenskyy’s camo clothing is any more objectionable than those fukken ridiculous (Chinese-made) red MAGA hats, trump and his halfwit cult wear?
-- Edited by Vam on Saturday 1st of March 2025 12:25:39 PM
Syl said
Mar 1 12:52 PM, 2025
I checked back on the reporter's 2 questions....one aimed at Trump, the second one aimed at Zelenskyy's 'disrespectful' outfit.
Journalist 'Brian'....(and a more obvious set up I have never seen) first asked Trump, 'Will his legacy be that of a peacemaker?'... This gave Trump the opportunity to describe himself as the second coming, with a good measure of how well he did in the elections thrown in...I swear I have never seen any human being crow as much as he does.
He thanked 'Brian' for a great question, then asked him for the second...all designed to rile Zelenskyy, who, in the circumstances, acted with more decorum and dignity in his little finger, than Trump and his Klingon have in their whole bodies.
Barksdale said
Mar 1 12:56 PM, 2025
Maddog wrote:
People are not used to a US president that gives zero fucks about anything that doesn't benefit the US, especially when we have a higher debt to GDP ratio than anyone in NATO save Greece and Italy..
OMG I thought the US debt to GDP ratio was about the same as ours (which is terrible) but recent estimates put it at 122-124%. You are lucky you have reserve status as you have maxed out the country's credit card!
Guess there is little option for the US given the perilous state of your finances. You need to get to balance the budget as soon as possible and ideally get to a surplus. Couple that with spending cuts as well as growth of at least 3% and inflation at 2% and you might not go broke, It's going to be really tough for ordinary Americans if austerity over here was anything to go by.
-- Edited by Barksdale on Saturday 1st of March 2025 12:57:35 PM
jackb said
Mar 1 1:05 PM, 2025
Anyone remember a thing called statesmanship... even great statesmanship?
Now it's yobishness and from extremely ignorant and dishonest fools.
Vam said
Mar 1 1:07 PM, 2025
Syl wrote:
I checked back on the reporter's 2 questions....one aimed at Trump, the second one aimed at Zelenskyy's 'disrespectful' outfit.
Journalist 'Brian'....(and a more obvious set up I have never seen) first asked Trump, 'Will his legacy be that of a peacemaker?'... This gave Trump the opportunity to describe himself as the second coming, with a good measure of how well he did in the elections thrown in...I swear I have never seen any human being crow as much as he does.
He thanked 'Brian' for a great question, then asked him for the second...all designed to rile Zelenskyy, who, in the circumstances, acted with more decorum and dignity in his little finger, than Trump and his Klingon have in their whole bodies.
Did you know that Brian is the boyfriend of trump’s most vocal Number One arse-kissing fan girl, Marjorie Taylor Greene? That should explain everything.
The thuggish no-mark masquerading as a ‘journalist’ on some obscure right wing media platform, left his wife and family to shack up with that bleached trollop masquerading as a member of congress. That’s why he’s even noticeable these days. But if you look closer, you’ll see he’s clearly a day-drinker. I guess having to be around that shrieking shrew every day, must be taking its toll.
-- Edited by Vam on Saturday 1st of March 2025 01:09:38 PM
-- Edited by Vam on Saturday 1st of March 2025 01:22:57 PM
Vam said
Mar 1 1:20 PM, 2025
jackb wrote:
Anyone remember a thing called statesmanship... even great statesmanship? Now it's yobishness and from extremely ignorant and dishonest fools.
Yes, Jack, I do. And it’s sad to see it all spiralling to shite.
The catalyst to the steadily eroding political rot was the moment that 6-times bankrupt, felonious, sociopathic huckster descended on that naff golden escalator to announce his run for the presidency.
He‘s been befouling every aspect of American institutions and norms ever since.
And the chickenshit eunuchs who continue to tolerate and enable him are no better, really.
Syl said
Mar 1 1:23 PM, 2025
Vam. Just looked them up, lovely couple.
Vam said
Mar 1 1:28 PM, 2025
@ Syl.
And that’s BEFORE the day drinking effect really started kicking in! I’m amazed he can see anything out of those puffy eyes these days.
jackb said
Mar 1 1:44 PM, 2025
America is truly down the toilet now as it has become a tv reality show... with nukes.
Forget what we're saying on here what will other heads of state around the world be thinking and saying!
It's not just a gift to Vlad it's a gift that seems to keep on giving to China too.
The stopping of aid for desperate places is a stopping of the projection of soft power around the world that will be filled rapidly by China... they will have ever more global influence.
It's a bit like America is rolling over onto it's back and giving up.
Why are they... they... letting Trump get away with this?
Drunks and junkies and imbeciles are now in charge of America or so it seems maybe.
Are they... the military and the intelligence community the bankers going to continue to let this madness unfold or are they going to stop it?
Maddog said
Mar 1 4:25 PM, 2025
Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:
Trump...the peacemaker. If anyone is going to start WW3....he's your man.
Watching the way he and his sidekick (who has never been near the Ukraine) bully Zelenskyy today, then have a hissy fit because Zelenskyy managed to say a few sentences, talking more sense in them than Trump managed all day...I can see this war escalating far further and wider than it has been.
What did Zelensky say that made sense for peace or for the US?
There can be no peace whilst Trump backs his friend Putin.
Trump repeatedly showed his knowledge of the Russia/Ukraine war was lacking, Vance jumped in, and when Zelensky asked respectfully to answer directly to Vance, who seemed to know less than Trump, Vance became defensive and insulting.
The two of them showed themselves up to be nasty bullies....speaking down to Zelenskyy as if they were headmaster and he was a child.
I doubt a world leader and his second in command have ever, in the history of TV, showed themselves up the way those two did.
As for the journalist who lowered the tone even further by criticising Zelenskies clothes, while Trump almost smirked...the whole event was a pathetic show of ignorance.
I don't disagree that they whole thing was quite the spectacle.
But this is how these things are done, albeit usually behind closed doors. Then they walk out to the press smiling and acting nice for the photos.
Trump doesn't do decorum..And he likely wanted to send a message too. Over here we call it FAFO.
Maddog said
Mar 1 4:29 PM, 2025
Barksdale wrote:
Maddog wrote:
People are not used to a US president that gives zero fucks about anything that doesn't benefit the US, especially when we have a higher debt to GDP ratio than anyone in NATO save Greece and Italy..
OMG I thought the US debt to GDP ratio was about the same as ours (which is terrible) but recent estimates put it at 122-124%. You are lucky you have reserve status as you have maxed out the country's credit card!
Guess there is little option for the US given the perilous state of your finances. You need to get to balance the budget as soon as possible and ideally get to a surplus. Couple that with spending cuts as well as growth of at least 3% and inflation at 2% and you might not go broke, It's going to be really tough for ordinary Americans if austerity over here was anything to go by.
-- Edited by Barksdale on Saturday 1st of March 2025 12:57:35 PM
And Social Security will not be able to cover expenses in a few years..
Imagine the howls when checks get smaller as prices increase.
I'm not sure Trump is going to accomplish much, however I know we couldn't keep doing the status quo..
Syl said
Mar 1 4:30 PM, 2025
He certainly sent a message to Putin.
As for 'behind closed doors', God knows what 'deal' those two have cooked up between them when they discussed Ukraine without the Ukraine president being allowed in to speak.
"You haven't once said thank you"
Great TV though.
Trump is an ass, but he has a point. If your war is paid for by the US taxpayer, you are in no position to negotiate.
-- Edited by Maddog on Friday 28th of February 2025 09:10:06 PM
I watched the build up to the argument again and you might have a point. I'm beginning to wonder if Zelenskky wanted an out for signing the minerals agreement and provoked an argument. Trump and Vance seemed to echo Putin talking points (and Vance lost his temper when Zelenskky mentioned that Putin had breached the 2015 ceasefire.) However, prior to that Zelenskky had been repeatedly taking shots about Russia / Putin's actions. If Trump and Vance are being honest brokers and seeking a peace deal (and I say this as someone who is highly suspicious of their motives) then all that would do is make a deal less likely as allowing it to slide would make them seem favourable to Ukraine.
What a shitshow.
It is a shit show, but this is how Trump negotiates.
I'd suggest no entity ever become dependent on him.
If Zelenskyy and Europe don't like this arrangement, they are free to go it on there own..
People are not used to a US president that gives zero fucks about anything that doesn't benefit the US, especially when we have a higher debt to GDP ratio than anyone in NATO save Greece and Italy..
The American people elected this imbecile. All those that voted for him are culpable with this Fascist Authoritarian madness.
What has the US brought to the world? Crap comedy. Bad food They are too loud and brash and mostly thick to put it mildly.
He's been invited for a state visit to the UK and just like the last time mass protests will plague his trip here as he polutes our soil the minute that he lands here.
The UK should cut ties with the US.
Not much that they could do about that.
There can be no peace whilst Trump backs his friend Putin.
Trump repeatedly showed his knowledge of the Russia/Ukraine war was lacking, Vance jumped in, and when Zelensky asked respectfully to answer directly to Vance, who seemed to know less than Trump, Vance became defensive and insulting.
The two of them showed themselves up to be nasty bullies....speaking down to Zelenskyy as if they were headmaster and he was a child.
I doubt a world leader and his second in command have ever, in the history of TV, showed themselves up the way those two did.
As for the journalist who lowered the tone even further by criticising Zelenskies clothes, while Trump almost smirked...the whole event was a pathetic show of ignorance.
Spot on, and Putin must have been rubbing his hands in delight when he saw it.
I couldn’t like this post more!
Every single word.
Vlad owns The Donald’s arse. Their unholy union started wayyyy back in the 80’s, when trump‘s properties/businesses were money-laundering Russian mob money. He‘ll be a Russian asset until he’s 6-feet under.
And as if yesterday’s Oval Office debacle wasn’t enough to prove his loyalty, it seems trump’s Defence Secretary - the former Fox weekend host/sexual abuser/functioning alcoholic - has ordered the US Cyber Command to stop monitoring/investigating Russian-related cybersecurity.
Just an extra little token of trump’s affection….‘knock yourself out, Vladimir!’
Syl: “ As for the journalist who lowered the tone even further by criticising Zelenskies clothes, while Trump almost smirked...the whole event was a pathetic show of ignorance.”
I’ve seen Zelenskyy in a suit, fwiw. He wears it verrry well
For now, Zelenskyy’s clothes are symbolic of a WARTIME President. I see it as a sign of utmost respect of his people, and in recognition of what Ukrainians have had to so bravely endure at Putin’s hands.
Could someone help me understand how Zelenskyy’s camo clothing is any more objectionable than those fukken ridiculous (Chinese-made) red MAGA hats, trump and his halfwit cult wear?
-- Edited by Vam on Saturday 1st of March 2025 12:25:39 PM
I checked back on the reporter's 2 questions....one aimed at Trump, the second one aimed at Zelenskyy's 'disrespectful' outfit.
This gave Trump the opportunity to describe himself as the second coming, with a good measure of how well he did in the elections thrown in...I swear I have never seen any human being crow as much as he does.
Journalist 'Brian'....(and a more obvious set up I have never seen) first asked Trump, 'Will his legacy be that of a peacemaker?'...
He thanked 'Brian' for a great question, then asked him for the second...all designed to rile Zelenskyy, who, in the circumstances, acted with more decorum and dignity in his little finger, than Trump and his Klingon have in their whole bodies.
OMG I thought the US debt to GDP ratio was about the same as ours (which is terrible) but recent estimates put it at 122-124%. You are lucky you have reserve status as you have maxed out the country's credit card!
Guess there is little option for the US given the perilous state of your finances. You need to get to balance the budget as soon as possible and ideally get to a surplus. Couple that with spending cuts as well as growth of at least 3% and inflation at 2% and you might not go broke, It's going to be really tough for ordinary Americans if austerity over here was anything to go by.
-- Edited by Barksdale on Saturday 1st of March 2025 12:57:35 PM
Now it's yobishness and from extremely ignorant and dishonest fools.
Did you know that Brian is the boyfriend of trump’s most vocal Number One arse-kissing fan girl, Marjorie Taylor Greene? That should explain everything.
The thuggish no-mark masquerading as a ‘journalist’ on some obscure right wing media platform, left his wife and family to shack up with that bleached trollop masquerading as a member of congress. That’s why he’s even noticeable these days. But if you look closer, you’ll see he’s clearly a day-drinker. I guess having to be around that shrieking shrew every day, must be taking its toll.
-- Edited by Vam on Saturday 1st of March 2025 01:09:38 PM
-- Edited by Vam on Saturday 1st of March 2025 01:22:57 PM
Yes, Jack, I do. And it’s sad to see it all spiralling to shite.
The catalyst to the steadily eroding political rot was the moment that 6-times bankrupt, felonious, sociopathic huckster descended on that naff golden escalator to announce his run for the presidency.
He‘s been befouling every aspect of American institutions and norms ever since.
And the chickenshit eunuchs who continue to tolerate and enable him are no better, really.
Vam. Just looked them up, lovely couple.
And that’s BEFORE the day drinking effect really started kicking in! I’m amazed he can see anything out of those puffy eyes these days.
Forget what we're saying on here what will other heads of state around the world be thinking and saying!
It's not just a gift to Vlad it's a gift that seems to keep on giving to China too.
The stopping of aid for desperate places is a stopping of the projection of soft power around the world that will be filled rapidly by China... they will have ever more global influence.
It's a bit like America is rolling over onto it's back and giving up.
Why are they... they... letting Trump get away with this?
Drunks and junkies and imbeciles are now in charge of America or so it seems maybe.
Are they... the military and the intelligence community the bankers going to continue to let this madness unfold or are they going to stop it?
I don't disagree that they whole thing was quite the spectacle.
But this is how these things are done, albeit usually behind closed doors. Then they walk out to the press smiling and acting nice for the photos.
Trump doesn't do decorum..And he likely wanted to send a message too. Over here we call it FAFO.
And Social Security will not be able to cover expenses in a few years..
Imagine the howls when checks get smaller as prices increase.
I'm not sure Trump is going to accomplish much, however I know we couldn't keep doing the status quo..
As for 'behind closed doors', God knows what 'deal' those two have cooked up between them when they discussed Ukraine without the Ukraine president being allowed in to speak.