ChaoticMusings

Anonymous wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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Racism works both ways. Constantly banging on about the way blacks are treated by us horrible white people and ignoring the way whites are treated by those horrible black people doesn't wash.

I don't want to be a noble white person grovelling along on one knee thanks very much. I show my respect by treating everyone, no matter the colour, the same as I wish to be treated myself. Far better than hamming it up in front of the cameras, or posting ridiculous pics on social media to prove to total strangers how very WOKE I am.

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 Syl I will not prolong this but to show respect and love to people who have been tortured and murdered for decades is not "woke". I don't have much time for silly buzzwords like that anyway, they mean nothing in the real world.

People  don't have to kneel if they think that is somehow demeaning, they can still show their support. But you are wrong to state those who are doing are doing so for the camera's. That may be your opinion but it's not a fact, and considering relatives of people killed by racist police have taken the knee I think it's a bit unkind.

As for your first paragraph you seem to think I'm talking about British people when I say White people. I don't, I mean any white men who historically engaged in slavery,  invaded countries where black people lived and called them their property. 

However the one comment I do feel saddened about is you saying that white people have been treated poorly by black people also, stating its not all one way.

Do you believe the races have treated each other equally? . Black people were murdered due to their skin colour,  enslaved and  tortured,  deemed second class citizens. Black people have certainly been treated far worse by white people historically and now. If you know all about the historic slavery  and the murders of black people by racist white police I don't see how you can possibly say white people suffer equal horrific treatment from black people. But if that's your opinion there is nothing more to say.

I hate speaking this way because it's not a contest, no race is superior or inferior to another. Supporting another race and showing you feel for their plight is not demeaning. .! But to deny the racism black people receive and have endured in the past just isn't fair imo. 

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 I certainly do think some are 'taking the knee' for the camera, that's my opinion, I dont doubt some are sincere, neither do I doubt that some are simply copying....they probably dont even understand the origin of why or where this started..

How far do you want to go back in order to castigate the way blacks have been treated by whites, and why not respond to other posts here that have tried to educate re slavery past and present?

I haven't said white people suffer equally ...either past or present, I said racism works both ways...and please point me to where I have stated that black people have not suffered from racism in the past....you made that up.

 

Although the majority of people drive on the right side of the road the majority of time. lol

Anonymous wrote:

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JP wrote:

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Judge a person by their behaviour. That's all you need to do.

The above needs to be stringently taught to all.

For many of us however it is very basic obvious stuff, that we have already lived by basically all of our lives. I certainly have.

Everyone is the same. Behaviour is what differentiates people.

Two men beat up a different old lady. One man happens to be black one happens to be white. Who the fuck cares about their colour.

Everyone can agree both of them are scum the lowest of the low.

Regularly people needlessly make things far too complicated. Very often if you go back to basics you can't go wrong.

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 I agree with you, it is behaviour not colour that matters. But it was not me that wanted a contest.

I mentioned the brutal murders commited by racist police and these tragedies were met with "but look at what happens to white people" all through the thread. I never once disputed that racism occurs to white people but frankly no, I don't think there is the same amount of white people murdered by black racists and I certainly think black people have historically suffered more barbaric injustices.

I wanted to know what posters thought we could do to move forward, how could racists,  yes in this case white ones who attempt to kill based on skin colour, be educated to accept  people are all equal and skin colour was irrelevant,

I despise segregation,  the very idea of it, but sorry if it offends but that was again a white man's creation. During the second world war segregation was rife in Britain even though Jamaican soldiers were fighting for their "mother country" because white people refused to be near them in any public place.

I do find it chilling that people honestly think that respecting the struggle of the black community is somehow staged or unfair to white people. I cannot fathom that mentality at all. 

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 We can look back and be outraged, but it was the times, the era and the mind set.   Victorian attitudes and outlooks were still very much the norm during WW2.   And that included the most egregious crimes against women and children too.    Homosexuality was a crime. Not that long ago women could be forced into asylums by husbands, and kids were slaves in the work place and being sent up chimneys.   It took decades to rid this country of all that.   There's no logic in comparing then to now.  

But...certain people in high places were trying their best.

John L Keith, amongst other Colonial Office officials, repeatedly voiced opposition to the idea that the British should adopt American attitudes towards black people. For example, in one 1942 memorandum he noted: ‘We should not allow any nonsense about rape, VD, etc., to deter us from sticking to our principles and resisting the so-called Southern American attitude towards Negroes’.

I don't think we'll ever get rid of racism, sexism, agesim, homophobia, etc.    Society is a veneer that is very very thin.   One only has to look back through history to see that.  

Most people are good people.   But when those same people are put into extreme situations, it's every man for himself.   I remember that dreadful Bosnian war in the 1990s where neighbour turned on neighbour, nearly 400,000 people died, and there was mass rape, genocide, ethnic cleansing.  They reckon up to 50,000 muslim women were raped by Serbs.  Serbians were responsible for the majority of the massacres and tortures.  Humans are tribal and war like.  Nothing will ever change that.

If we, as a species, were capable of loving each other unconditionally, and putting aside differences, etc, we'd have done it by now.    As the old Arabic proverb goes....the dogs bark and the caravan passes by.

It’s not just Victorian times or an American problem . It’s today and here.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/53301318

a kid in the car too.

racial profiling is racism 

Digger wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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It’s not just Victorian times or an American problem . It’s today and here.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/53301318

a kid in the car too.

racial profiling is racism 

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 Police say the vehicle had been on the wrong side of the road and the driver sped off when asked to stop.

Officers were patrolling in the Maida Vale area because of an increase in youth violence.

A police statement said: "Officers from the Directorate of Professional Standards have reviewed both footage from social media, and the body-worn video of the officers, and are satisfied that there is no concern around the officers' conduct."

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 They would say that wouldn’t they?

JP wrote:

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Digger wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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It’s not just Victorian times or an American problem . It’s today and here.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/53301318

a kid in the car too.

racial profiling is racism 

---

 Police say the vehicle had been on the wrong side of the road and the driver sped off when asked to stop.

Officers were patrolling in the Maida Vale area because of an increase in youth violence.

A police statement said: "Officers from the Directorate of Professional Standards have reviewed both footage from social media, and the body-worn video of the officers, and are satisfied that there is no concern around the officers' conduct."

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 They must be quite confident they are correct. They most likely have the incident recorded on their dash cams.

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 Yea sure. they Never lie or cover up their faults do they?

Digger wrote:

---

Anonymous wrote:

---

JP wrote:

---

Judge a person by their behaviour. That's all you need to do.

The above needs to be stringently taught to all.

For many of us however it is very basic obvious stuff, that we have already lived by basically all of our lives. I certainly have.

Everyone is the same. Behaviour is what differentiates people.

Two men beat up a different old lady. One man happens to be black one happens to be white. Who the fuck cares about their colour.

Everyone can agree both of them are scum the lowest of the low.

Regularly people needlessly make things far too complicated. Very often if you go back to basics you can't go wrong.

---

 I agree with you, it is behaviour not colour that matters. But it was not me that wanted a contest.

I mentioned the brutal murders commited by racist police and these tragedies were met with "but look at what happens to white people" all through the thread. I never once disputed that racism occurs to white people but frankly no, I don't think there is the same amount of white people murdered by black racists and I certainly think black people have historically suffered more barbaric injustices.

I wanted to know what posters thought we could do to move forward, how could racists,  yes in this case white ones who attempt to kill based on skin colour, be educated to accept  people are all equal and skin colour was irrelevant,

I despise segregation,  the very idea of it, but sorry if it offends but that was again a white man's creation. During the second world war segregation was rife in Britain even though Jamaican soldiers were fighting for their "mother country" because white people refused to be near them in any public place.

I do find it chilling that people honestly think that respecting the struggle of the black community is somehow staged or unfair to white people. I cannot fathom that mentality at all. 

---

 We can look back and be outraged, but it was the times, the era and the mind set.   Victorian attitudes and outlooks were still very much the norm during WW2.   And that included the most egregious crimes against women and children too.    Homosexuality was a crime. Not that long ago women could be forced into asylums by husbands, and kids were slaves in the work place and being sent up chimneys.   It took decades to rid this country of all that.   There's no logic in comparing then to now.  

But...certain people in high places were trying their best.

John L Keith, amongst other Colonial Office officials, repeatedly voiced opposition to the idea that the British should adopt American attitudes towards black people. For example, in one 1942 memorandum he noted: ‘We should not allow any nonsense about rape, VD, etc., to deter us from sticking to our principles and resisting the so-called Southern American attitude towards Negroes’.

I don't think we'll ever get rid of racism, sexism, agesim, homophobia, etc.    Society is a veneer that is very very thin.   One only has to look back through history to see that.  

Most people are good people.   But when those same people are put into extreme situations, it's every man for himself.   I remember that dreadful Bosnian war in the 1990s where neighbour turned on neighbour, nearly 400,000 people died, and there was mass rape, genocide, ethnic cleansing.  They reckon up to 50,000 muslim women were raped by Serbs.  Serbians were responsible for the majority of the massacres and tortures.  Humans are tribal and war like.  Nothing will ever change that.

If we, as a species, were capable of loving each other unconditionally, and putting aside differences, etc, we'd have done it by now.    As the old Arabic proverb goes....the dogs bark and the caravan passes by.

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 Thankyou for your civil response .

Humans have always turned against each other for the most part. There wouldn't of been any slavery at all if people hadn't agreed that a skin colour was superior just because it was paler, that people who loved the same gender should be killed.  An individual when talked to reasonably and with respect can change their mind. Men even tried to deny women had the intelligence to vote and gave them a little "home correction" ergo beat them up  , if their tea wasn't on the table by 5.

A group of people can become a mob and never does, in fact their need to hurt and wound, exclude and humiliate increases.

Humans are tribal and war like innately, but I feel we are too advanced as a species and too educated to get away with that as an excuse now. I apologise if people mistakenly  thought I was only critiquing the British, I know how much more racist the Americans are but in this day and age to kill a man on his knees publicly, that murder really got to me. That man will never open his eyes again because another man decided he should die due to his skin colour, and that mentality is so alien to me possibly I became too narrow-minded during the thread. 

Individuals can love unconditionally and forgive others. I think the BLM is a worthwhile movement in light of recent events and couldn't understand why some couldn't say one good word about it , choosing instead to see it as attention seeking. Black people are dead. Attention seeking is the least important thing about it.

But Thankyou Digger for your articulate and very worthwhile responses throughout.

I could have missed it in the reams of text you post but I didn't see an apology, or more importantly a correction to the list you say you spent hours composing.

Dont bother posting any more lists of people dead or alive, I'm sure the majority of people wont read up on them anyway. It does show however that retweeting false Twitter posts onto a public forum doesn't really further your cause.

Eg....Christian Cooper (Birding) one of the men on the list was neither killed by police, arrested by police or in any way bothered by the police. However the idiot white woman who he made the video of was sacked from her employment.
It irks when when people (you in this case) make sweeping statements as in.....

"I understand you may be offended at the term white Privellege but the list below cannot be denied.

The lives below were lost because the person doing these activities were black. No white person is afraid of doing the activities listed below.

Google the name of the deceased to see the exact incident that killed them if you wish.

Below is the activity the black person was doing when slain by police. Why you may ask. Why indeed."

-- Edited by Syl on Tuesday 7th of July 2020 05:30:13 PM

Anonymous wrote:

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Digger wrote:

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 We can look back and be outraged, but it was the times, the era and the mind set.   Victorian attitudes and outlooks were still very much the norm during WW2.   And that included the most egregious crimes against women and children too.    Homosexuality was a crime. Not that long ago women could be forced into asylums by husbands, and kids were slaves in the work place and being sent up chimneys.   It took decades to rid this country of all that.   There's no logic in comparing then to now.  

But...certain people in high places were trying their best.

John L Keith, amongst other Colonial Office officials, repeatedly voiced opposition to the idea that the British should adopt American attitudes towards black people. For example, in one 1942 memorandum he noted: ‘We should not allow any nonsense about rape, VD, etc., to deter us from sticking to our principles and resisting the so-called Southern American attitude towards Negroes’.

I don't think we'll ever get rid of racism, sexism, agesim, homophobia, etc.    Society is a veneer that is very very thin.   One only has to look back through history to see that.  

Most people are good people.   But when those same people are put into extreme situations, it's every man for himself.   I remember that dreadful Bosnian war in the 1990s where neighbour turned on neighbour, nearly 400,000 people died, and there was mass rape, genocide, ethnic cleansing.  They reckon up to 50,000 muslim women were raped by Serbs.  Serbians were responsible for the majority of the massacres and tortures.  Humans are tribal and war like.  Nothing will ever change that.

If we, as a species, were capable of loving each other unconditionally, and putting aside differences, etc, we'd have done it by now.    As the old Arabic proverb goes....the dogs bark and the caravan passes by.

---

 Thankyou for your civil response .

Humans have always turned against each other for the most part. There wouldn't of been any slavery at all if people hadn't agreed that a skin colour was superior just because it was paler, that people who loved the same gender should be killed.  An individual when talked to reasonably and with respect can change their mind. Men even tried to deny women had the intelligence to vote and gave them a little "home correction" ergo beat them up  , if their tea wasn't on the table by 5.

A group of people can become a mob and never does, in fact their need to hurt and wound, exclude and humiliate increases.

Humans are tribal and war like innately, but I feel we are too advanced as a species and too educated to get away with that as an excuse now. I apologise if people mistakenly  thought I was only critiquing the British, I know how much more racist the Americans are but in this day and age to kill a man on his knees publicly, that murder really got to me. That man will never open his eyes again because another man decided he should die due to his skin colour, and that mentality is so alien to me possibly I became too narrow-minded during the thread. 

Individuals can love unconditionally and forgive others. I think the BLM is a worthwhile movement in light of recent events and couldn't understand why some couldn't say one good word about it , choosing instead to see it as attention seeking. Black people are dead. Attention seeking is the least important thing about it.

But Thankyou Digger for your articulate and very worthwhile responses throughout.

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 You’re a bit of a smarmy, condescending twat arent you! 

-- Edited by Digger on Tuesday 7th of July 2020 06:44:58 PM