ChaoticMusings

Date: Sep 17 11:26 AM, 2023

RE: Dispatches...

Syl · FIRM BUT FAIR.

According to last nights programme, women did complain, bosses did sod all. He was warned repeatedly, he even had a clause in his contract that he was not to date any of the staff or audience that were invited to his BB show.
He was reported, but those reports were either not passed to a higher level, or as so often happens, the higher level do sod all....then claim they had no idea.

I think Bob Geldof had it right, and that was 17 years ago....a look of disdain and a one word put down...and Brands face was a picture.

Bob Geldof insults Russell Brand at NME Awards in resurfaced clip | Culture | Independent TV

-- Edited by Syl on Sunday 17th of September 2023 11:46:55 AM

Syl · FIRM BUT FAIR.

Anonymous wrote:
Digger wrote:
Every single woman I know would have either reported his behaviour there and then or walked off and never interacted with him again.

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None of the women were women you know so that's beside the point really.. You never know how someone will react to something like this unless it actually happens to them. Agreed it might seem odd not to report at the time but things get com[licated
There seems to be an undercurrent of what might be interpreted as victim blaming in your comments, but not unusual, it is a common opinion that regularly seems to come from older women when historic sexual abuse is reported, such as in the recent Virginia Roberts claims. Mind you, yes in simple terms you'd think if someone was abused they wouldn't go back. But they do. Look also at women caught up in violent domestic relationships, and the regular comments 'they should walk out' but which fail to understand the emotional complexities of those cases.
Whatever the facts in this case the women involved were right to raise it now if a crime was committed even if it was ten years ago. The one thing I disagree with is this form of trial by media/social media when someone is named and shamed before being criminally charged, and bearing in mind that in this case there might never be a criminal charge.

Women get involved, or stay in abusive relationships for all manner of reasons.

I have known a couple in real life, but also, what was very telling, a few years ago, as on here, we had an agony column on a forum. Domestic violence was brought up. Three or four regular posters said they had been in an abusive relationship, and stayed, till they eventually found the courage to leave. A couple of the women said they had never spoken about the abuse before. Fear, embarrassment, safety for their children, even because they still loved the man...and so on.

I always think you have to walk in someone elses shoes to really know why people act a they do.

Syl · FIRM BUT FAIR.

Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:
Priscilla Presley has said she was a virgin till the day she married.
She may have dated Elvis when she was 14, they didn't we'd till she was 21.
She was living with him at 16.

Maybe she was a virgin. He and her were still engaged in adult activities including drug use that 16 year olds shouldn't be doing and would be considered a crime.

That doesn't excuse Russell fucking around with a 16 year old though. I wonder how many 16 year olds have been backstage at rock concerts? Doesn't make it right, but it's part of the culture.

Elvis and Priscillas relationshi was odd. She was 14, he was a grown man. He was worldly and surrounded by sycophants after he left the army, she went into his world. God knows why her parents allowed it, she was still a child.

But....he can't be compared to Brand, who it seems was a predator who always treated women like dirt.

Everyone knew about Saville's lifestyle, everyone kept quiet, this conversation which was played last night, sums up Brand's attitude to women very well.

Listen: Russell Brand offers ‘naked assistant’ to meet Jimmy Savile | Culture | Independent TV

Date: Sep 17 12:48 PM, 2023

Syl wrote:
According to last nights programme, women did complain, bosses did sod all. He was warned repeatedly, he even had a clause in his contract that he was not to date any of the staff or audience that were invited to his BB show.
He was reported, but those reports were either not passed to a higher level, or as so often happens, the higher level do sod all....then claim they had no idea.

I think Bob Geldof had it right, and that was 17 years ago....a look of disdain and a one word put down...and Brands face was a picture.

Bob Geldof insults Russell Brand at NME Awards in resurfaced clip | Culture | Independent TV

-- Edited by Syl on Sunday 17th of September 2023 11:46:55 AM

the look of raw fury never gets old!

Geldof perfectly summed up Brand’s malignant narcissism.

Digger · Admin

Anonymous wrote:
Digger wrote:
Every single woman I know would have either reported his behaviour there and then or walked off and never interacted with him again.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
None of the women were women you know so that's beside the point really.. You never know how someone will react to something like this unless it actually happens to them. Agreed it might seem odd not to report at the time but things get com[licated
There seems to be an undercurrent of what might be interpreted as victim blaming in your comments, but not unusual, it is a common opinion that regularly seems to come from older women when historic sexual abuse is reported, such as in the recent Virginia Roberts claims. Mind you, yes in simple terms you'd think if someone was abused they wouldn't go back. But they do. Look also at women caught up in violent domestic relationships, and the regular comments 'they should walk out' but which fail to understand the emotional complexities of those cases.
Whatever the facts in this case the women involved were right to raise it now if a crime was committed even if it was ten years ago. The one thing I disagree with is this form of trial by media/social media when someone is named and shamed before being criminally charged, and bearing in mind that in this case there might never be a criminal charge.

Wasn't there just one 16 year old? One was 24 and the other in her thirties.

He's reaping what he's sown after all his years of sleaze and I don't sympathise with him. What I do find disturbing is the level of media outrage and coverage this gets while the sick paedo's in the muslim community are still walking the streets.

Digger · Admin

Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:
Priscilla Presley has said she was a virgin till the day she married.
She may have dated Elvis when she was 14, they didn't we'd till she was 21.
She was living with him at 16.

Maybe she was a virgin. He and her were still engaged in adult activities including drug use that 16 year olds shouldn't be doing and would be considered a crime.

That doesn't excuse Russell fucking around with a 16 year old though. I wonder how many 16 year olds have been backstage at rock concerts? Doesn't make it right, but it's part of the culture.

Elvis and Priscillas relationshi was odd. She was 14, he was a grown man. He was worldly and surrounded by sycophants after he left the army, she went into his world. God knows why her parents allowed it, she was still a child.
But....he can't be compared to Brand, who it seems was a predator who always treated women like dirt.
Everyone knew about Saville's lifestyle, everyone kept quiet, this conversation which was played last night, sums up Brand's attitude to women very well.

Listen: Russell Brand offers ‘naked assistant’ to meet Jimmy Savile | Culture | Independent TV

Elvis Presley was a predator. And he liked them young. His favourite joke was "14 will get you 20".

Letitia Kirk, who was his nurse throughout the 1970s, said she saw so many teenage girls brought to his Tennessee mansion by his entourage that she lost count. One man, the DJ George Klein, was his 'pimp,' she says, 'bringing these little young teenagers up for Elvis to check out. It was a revolving door. I didn't even try to learn their names. Too much for me.'

Date: Sep 17 1:37 PM, 2023

Digger wrote:

What I do find disturbing is the level of media outrage and coverage this gets while the sick paedo's in the muslim community are still walking the streets.

I don't quite follow ... are you saying this shouldn't have been investigated because there are also Muslim offenders out there? If there are why should that let Brand off the hook?

Digger · Admin

Syl wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Digger wrote:
Every single woman I know would have either reported his behaviour there and then or walked off and never interacted with him again.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
None of the women were women you know so that's beside the point really.. You never know how someone will react to something like this unless it actually happens to them. Agreed it might seem odd not to report at the time but things get com[licated
There seems to be an undercurrent of what might be interpreted as victim blaming in your comments, but not unusual, it is a common opinion that regularly seems to come from older women when historic sexual abuse is reported, such as in the recent Virginia Roberts claims. Mind you, yes in simple terms you'd think if someone was abused they wouldn't go back. But they do. Look also at women caught up in violent domestic relationships, and the regular comments 'they should walk out' but which fail to understand the emotional complexities of those cases.
Whatever the facts in this case the women involved were right to raise it now if a crime was committed even if it was ten years ago. The one thing I disagree with is this form of trial by media/social media when someone is named and shamed before being criminally charged, and bearing in mind that in this case there might never be a criminal charge.

Women get involved, or stay in abusive relationships for all manner of reasons.
I have known a couple in real life, but also, what was very telling, a few years ago, as on here, we had an agony column on a forum. Domestic violence was brought up. Three or four regular posters said they had been in an abusive relationship, and stayed, till they eventually found the courage to leave. A couple of the women said they had never spoken about the abuse before. Fear, embarrassment, safety for their children, even because they still loved the man...and so on.
I always think you have to walk in someone elses shoes to really know why people act a they do.

I've lived with domestic abuse, grew up around it. So I know all about it and how terrible it can be. And it's often complicated and yes, people stay or tolerate it for a variety of reasons. And then you have women who enjoy the frisson abuse gives them. I knew someone like that. She loved the fight, break up and then make up. And the mind games she played to keep it all stoked up were just awful.

It's one thing to be trapped in a marriage or a relationship and quite another to have a one night stand with a known sexual deviant like Brand and then moan about being used. One woman is saying he shagged her then never rang her again. Well, that's your learning curve. Next time you can spot the red flags.

I don't believe that Brand is the violent type and I don't believe that any of those women were scared of him, thought their lives were in danger, or their kids' lives etc. They may have felt embarrassed after the act and thought keeping silent the best option. And let's face it, if you sleep with someone who uses you and discards you, why are you going to tell the world about it? Or perhaps you're going to let it fester for a decade or two and bide your time to get your revenge?

Brand is a famous, rich, spoiled, narcissistic and selfish and emotionally immature sex addict. And he's been open about that behaviour for decades. He even wrote a book about it. So it's not as though these women had no idea who or what he was/is.

I'm sorry but I just don't run with the pearl clutching herd when it comes to this kind of thing. I'm not concerned with women who have one night stands with a famous person or get swayed by the charm of celebrity then cry rape 15 years later. I'm more concerned about little kids getting abused and murdered by paedophiles and their own parents.

Digger · Admin

Anonymous wrote:
Digger wrote:

What I do find disturbing is the level of media outrage and coverage this gets while the sick paedo's in the muslim community are still walking the streets.
I don't quite follow ... are you saying this shouldn't have been investigated because there are also Muslim offenders out there? If there are why should that let Brand off the hook?

Yes, you do follow. You follow exactly. Now, post something that contributes to the thread rather than a lame attempt at baiting.

Date: Sep 17 2:07 PM, 2023

Anonymous wrote:
Syl wrote:
According to last nights programme, women did complain, bosses did sod all. He was warned repeatedly, he even had a clause in his contract that he was not to date any of the staff or audience that were invited to his BB show.
He was reported, but those reports were either not passed to a higher level, or as so often happens, the higher level do sod all....then claim they had no idea.

I think Bob Geldof had it right, and that was 17 years ago....a look of disdain and a one word put down...and Brands face was a picture.

Bob Geldof insults Russell Brand at NME Awards in resurfaced clip | Culture | Independent TV

-- Edited by Syl on Sunday 17th of September 2023 11:46:55 AM
the look of raw fury never gets old!
Geldof perfectly summed up Brand’s malignant narcissism.

… oops! Sorry ^^ that was me, fwiw.

I‘ve been YouTubing a couple of recent Brand clips. So many rabbit holes! Anti vax, adoring Putin/RFK Jr/Tucker fanboy, (imo) off his face and definitely off his meds.

And clearly still desperate to be relevant again.

Syl · FIRM BUT FAIR.

Digger wrote:
Syl wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Digger wrote:
Every single woman I know would have either reported his behaviour there and then or walked off and never interacted with him again.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
None of the women were women you know so that's beside the point really.. You never know how someone will react to something like this unless it actually happens to them. Agreed it might seem odd not to report at the time but things get com[licated
There seems to be an undercurrent of what might be interpreted as victim blaming in your comments, but not unusual, it is a common opinion that regularly seems to come from older women when historic sexual abuse is reported, such as in the recent Virginia Roberts claims. Mind you, yes in simple terms you'd think if someone was abused they wouldn't go back. But they do. Look also at women caught up in violent domestic relationships, and the regular comments 'they should walk out' but which fail to understand the emotional complexities of those cases.
Whatever the facts in this case the women involved were right to raise it now if a crime was committed even if it was ten years ago. The one thing I disagree with is this form of trial by media/social media when someone is named and shamed before being criminally charged, and bearing in mind that in this case there might never be a criminal charge.

Women get involved, or stay in abusive relationships for all manner of reasons.
I have known a couple in real life, but also, what was very telling, a few years ago, as on here, we had an agony column on a forum. Domestic violence was brought up. Three or four regular posters said they had been in an abusive relationship, and stayed, till they eventually found the courage to leave. A couple of the women said they had never spoken about the abuse before. Fear, embarrassment, safety for their children, even because they still loved the man...and so on.
I always think you have to walk in someone elses shoes to really know why people act a they do.
I've lived with domestic abuse, grew up around it. So I know all about it and how terrible it can be. And it's often complicated and yes, people stay or tolerate it for a variety of reasons. And then you have women who enjoy the frisson abuse gives them. I knew someone like that. She loved the fight, break up and then make up. And the mind games she played to keep it all stoked up were just awful.
It's one thing to be trapped in a marriage or a relationship and quite another to have a one night stand with a known sexual deviant like Brand and then moan about being used. One woman is saying he shagged her then never rang her again. Well, that's your learning curve. Next time you can spot the red flags.
I don't believe that Brand is the violent type and I don't believe that any of those women were scared of him, thought their lives were in danger, or their kids' lives etc. They may have felt embarrassed after the act and thought keeping silent the best option. And let's face it, if you sleep with someone who uses you and discards you, why are you going to tell the world about it? Or perhaps you're going to let it fester for a decade or two and bide your time to get your revenge?
Brand is a famous, rich, spoiled, narcissistic and selfish and emotionally immature sex addict. And he's been open about that behaviour for decades. He even wrote a book about it. So it's not as though these women had no idea who or what he was/is.
I'm sorry but I just don't run with the pearl clutching herd when it comes to this kind of thing. I'm not concerned with women who have one night stands with a famous person or get swayed by the charm of celebrity then cry rape 15 years later. I'm more concerned about little kids getting abused and murdered by paedophiles and their own parents.

I agree that women who have one night stands, then feel used because the man never rings again, have nothing to complain about. If you are that easy you choose to sleep with strangers, celebrities or not, that's all you are to them...a quick shag.

Last night a former PA of his said she became sickened at his callous behaviour towards women, all young, but as far as she saw, all over 18 and all willing, well that's par for the course with horny celebs who think they are Gods gift. I have little sympathy for those women tbh.

But his behaviour was a lot darker than that, forcing his penis down an unwilling young girls throat so she had to punch him to get him off her, overpowering other women and forcing himself into them, no matter the woman be 16 or 30, that's a crime.

The other stuff just pads out the fact he is a rapist and an abuser.

Syl · FIRM BUT FAIR.

It will be interesting to see if any charges will be brought, because in the eyes of the law, so far, he is guilty of nothing.

Date: Sep 17 4:29 PM, 2023

Syl wrote:
....

Bob Geldof insults Russell Brand at NME Awards in resurfaced clip | Culture | Independent TV

-- Edited by Syl on Sunday 17th of September 2023 11:46:55 AM

What is it with Independent media. They put a clip out for clicks but bleep out the only reason for showing the clip. They should either show it uncensored or not at all - but have a warning.

Digger · Admin

Syl wrote:

I agree that women who have one night stands, then feel used because the man never rings again, have nothing to complain about. If you are that easy you choose to sleep with strangers, celebrities or not, that's all you are to them...a quick shag.
Last night a former PA of his said she became sickened at his callous behaviour towards women, all young, but as far as she saw, all over 18 and all willing, well that's par for the course with horny celebs who think they are Gods gift. I have little sympathy for those women tbh.
But his behaviour was a lot darker than that, forcing his penis down an unwilling young girls throat so she had to punch him to get him off her, overpowering other women and forcing himself into them, no matter the woman be 16 or 30, that's a crime.
The other stuff just pads out the fact he is a rapist and an abuser.

Remember that idiot prank he pulled with Andrew Sachs? It really was despicable. He's an idiot, there's no denying it and I'm not talking about his IQ. He might have calmed down and is now a family man but you know, shit sticks and things can come back to haunt you. It really is karma. But....I still think that he needs a fair trial and even with all the media circus he could be proved innocent of the accusations. Only time will tell.

Digger · Admin

Syl wrote:
It will be interesting to see if any charges will be brought, because in the eyes of the law, so far, he is guilty of nothing.

If they can accuse poor old Cliff, then nobody else stands a chance.

Maddog · Go Outside

Digger wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Digger wrote:
'Rachel' - not her real name - told The Times in a report published today that when she was 24, Brand flashed his penis at her as she walked into his dressing room.  She claims that the comedian and actor 'insinuated' that she could perform oral sex on him. Rachel said she was shocked by the comment and refused.

She then goes on to have a relationship with him. ??? Why would you?
Naive, vulnerable victim being exploited?
She initially seemed strong enough to be shocked and refuse his advances. What changed? She could have continued to say no. Every single woman I know would have either reported his behaviour there and then or walked off and never interacted with him again.
According to some sources he was reported but once again the good old BBC refused to act.

It does kind of make women look weak. I don't think that's the case with most women..

Even the assault with the 16 year old wasn't much of an assault. His dick didn't accidentally slip into her mouth. She was performing felatio and he jammed it down her throat, made her choke and she punched him..

What most women would say "not cool asshole", and cut him off for awhile. While I have no idea if she cut him off, this event didn't seem to end the relationship..

So now what? Are there any plans for criminal investigations, or do we all just sit back and make up our minds on who's lying the most amd who's lying the least?.

Maddog · Go Outside

While not completely the same, this reminds me of the girls now complaining they were sexually abused by Hugh Hefner and others while they lived at the Playboy mansion.

There are certain expectations when engaging in certain activities. Brand or Hefner were a know commodity. Women can't feign ignorance when they choose to enter that world..

Date: Sep 17 5:25 PM, 2023

Maddog wrote:
Digger wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Digger wrote:
'Rachel' - not her real name - told The Times in a report published today that when she was 24, Brand flashed his penis at her as she walked into his dressing room.  She claims that the comedian and actor 'insinuated' that she could perform oral sex on him. Rachel said she was shocked by the comment and refused.

She then goes on to have a relationship with him. ??? Why would you?
Naive, vulnerable victim being exploited?
She initially seemed strong enough to be shocked and refuse his advances. What changed? She could have continued to say no. Every single woman I know would have either reported his behaviour there and then or walked off and never interacted with him again.
According to some sources he was reported but once again the good old BBC refused to act.
It does kind of make women look weak. I don't think that's the case with most women..

Even the assault with the 16 year old wasn't much of an assault. His dick didn't accidentally slip into her mouth. She was performing felatio and he jammed it down her throat, made her choke and she punched him..

What most women would say "not cool asshole", and cut him off for awhile. While I have no idea if she cut him off, this event didn't seem to end the relationship..

So now what? Are there any plans for criminal investigations, or do we all just sit back and make up our minds on who's lying the most amd who's lying the least?.

Depends on whether any victims report a crime to the police, although it looks like that hasn't happened. On the other hand would the police, reading about this, proactively approach an alleged victim to ask for a direct report then decide whether or not to take action? - I don't know if they operate that way. In the UK the police are meant to act if a crime comes to their attention but is a third hand press report enough to count?

Date: Sep 17 5:56 PM, 2023

Zero sympathy for any heat this hyperactive gobby dickhead may be feeling right now, especially in view of the company he keeps and the unbelievably spiteful stunt he pulled on Andrew Sachs.

That said, (imo) in cases like this no one should be publicly named and shamed until after investigations are completed, after charges are brought, after a trial is concluded, and only if a Guilty verdict is delivered.