jackb wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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Barksdale wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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www.theguardian.com/politics/2025/feb/15/rachel-reeves-has-three-options-to-dodge-an-economic-crisis-and-all-are-unthinkable

I'm glad I don't have her job. If she raises taxes, folks will howl. If she cuts spending folks will howl. If she kicks the can down the road and just throws it on the credit card, she will be irresponsible.

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 Lol....I doubt even she would have her job if she hadn't lied through the teeth about her working history. 

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 And there is something to that. People who want those jobs tend to be a little full of shit, and the decent honest folks will never rise through the ranks to get there..

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She's suitable for the job (despite the strange seeming embellishments on her Linked In profile, which everyone exaggerates anyway.) That's why she has been going on so much about growth as she has spotted a fundamental weakness in our economy - an unsustainable debt to GDP ratio. She needs growth because otherwise it will become more and more expensive for us to borrow money, and the markets will expect to see a plan before lowering the interest rates which we can borrow on the money markets. 

Unfortunately, I think the ultimate solution will be a return to austerity unless growth comes soon. That will be deeply unpopular and we will probably not go into the next election with Starmer as our PM and Reeves as our Chancellor. I don't think any of the political parties have the will to take on the billionaire class so we will have really poor living standards for many years I think. I'm not sure a lot of people appreciate how hard it may ultimately be. 

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 Yes fixing the problem is not going to be painless and the problem with politics is there is always the next snake oil salesman claiming it can be.

 

Even while I applaud Trumps cuts, he's not being honest with the American people. Even of he's successful it's going to be worse before it gets better. He should say as much..

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 He has said it will be painful for a while.

What he's not saying is he and Musk and their gang are crashing the economy on purpose.

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 He hasn't mentioned one bit of pain, and crashing the economy (whatever that means) isn't a goal of any politician. Whether they serve in your country or mine. Pissed off, unhappy people are difficult to keep in line, which is exactly why politicians don't do the difficult things and continue to kick the can down the road..

Maddog wrote:

 He hasn't mentioned one bit of pain, and crashing the economy (whatever that means) isn't a goal of any politician. Whether they serve in your country or mine. Pissed off, unhappy people are difficult to keep in line, which is exactly why politicians don't do the difficult things and continue to kick the can down the road..

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If the US version of austerity is anything like the UK version of the same policy then you will have a "come to Jesus" moment in a few years when people realise how tough life can be.

Most Americans have been relatively comfortable for a long time and had good living standards. When they fall there is bound to be some backlash. I heard a good description of the UK on social media recently that it is a poor country attached to a rich city, London. There is some truth to that because even though it is swept under the carpet there is some really awful poverty in parts of the UK and it is growing. Honestly if I was 25 now and wanting to make a life for myself I would leave the UK unless I had parental wealth to rely on. it is increasingly a rigged game. 

Syl wrote:

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The people who have known real poverty in the UK are either old or dead. I am thinking this new laughably called Labour government, are thinking dead is preferable to old.

God willing that sort of poverty doesn't come back here, because now people actually know how the other half live, via TV, news, internet, I doubt they would be accepting as the older generation was.

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As I've said before, I'm really worried about the UK economy and where it is going.

Part of my job now involves travelling to different parts of the country (many of which are deprived, for various reasons which I won't elaborate on.) Before that I had been based exclusively in London. I have been taken aback by the levels of deprivation I have seen. Although you can see it on social media until you experience the reality of it firsthand you can't really comprehend what is like. If, as I suspect, things well get worse then we will have a lot of really unhappy people here. I don't blame anyone for leaving if they can. 

We are probably a few years off from when it begins to bite and hopefully growth will come (or we get radical with our taxation policy, which I doubt though) before then.  

Barksdale wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

 He hasn't mentioned one bit of pain, and crashing the economy (whatever that means) isn't a goal of any politician. Whether they serve in your country or mine. Pissed off, unhappy people are difficult to keep in line, which is exactly why politicians don't do the difficult things and continue to kick the can down the road..

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If the US version of austerity is anything like the UK version of the same policy then you will have a "come to Jesus" moment in a few years when people realise how tough life can be.

Most Americans have been relatively comfortable for a long time and had good living standards. When they fall there is bound to be some backlash. I heard a good description of the UK on social media recently that it is a poor country attached to a rich city, London. There is some truth to that because even though it is swept under the carpet there is some really awful poverty in parts of the UK and it is growing. Honestly if I was 25 now and wanting to make a life for myself I would leave the UK unless I had parental wealth to rely on. it is increasingly a rigged game. 

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 Oh, people used to the government spending money it doesn't have for things it's not supposed to, will wail like children. It's why it's important not to start all of this dependency. It's almost impossible to unwind it..

Barksdale wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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I am Northern, outside of Manchester now, I know well some suburbs that are poverty ridden.
I have one friend in particular who lives in London. For many years we have compared the N/S divide...it's not just an expression, as you now know, it's a reality.

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What is up with the transport system in the North? I will never complain about the transportation in London again having experienced it. Money really needs to flow out of London and into the North, coastal towns and other parts of the country so wealth is shared fairly.

What happened to levelling up? Looks like it was just a campaign slogan. 

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 Levelling up was just another empty promise.

Mayor of Greater Manchester, Andy Burnham is fighting to advance our bus, rail and tram services, and he(in my opinion) is doing his best for the north. He is trying to model Manchester bus services to operate similar to London transport, it's always been far more expensive to travel round Manchester than London, but improving the services all boils down to money. We now have the Bee network in some areas, which is council owned and cheaper.

It's not new that the north has always suffered re public funding... NHS, schools, jobs etc, obviously wages are lower, household bills are just as expensive, rents may be lower, but even they are shooting up to meet London rates.

Barksdale wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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Labour were mentioning taxing ISA's.
I wonder how many billiions are stashed away in them, untaxed.

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 Labour under Starmer and Reeves just aren't brave enough sadly. There is a time to be sensible and there is a time to be radical. 

I can't see much changing as they tinker around the edges. We saw a worrying uptick in inflation figures today. If growth stalls I fully expect the Spring statement to signal a return to austerity type measures.

The country will be sold from underneath our feet while they stare blankly into the middle distance. 

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 Personally, I think her taking the winter fuel payment off the majority of pensioners, one of the first things she did when Labour gained power, was a really bad decision. 

It made her, Starmer, and the rest of them, look like hypocrites, especially when their own expenses, claims and freebies were exposed.

Since then they have lurched from disaster to disaster.

The latest being the expose of the eleven Tameside Ministers, MP, and counsellors,  who have been sacked or suspended for their WhatsApp shenanigans.

Barksdale wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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Too late for me to emigrate, but I would not blame anyone who did, though where?

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 For me, I'm looking at 5 years from now.

If I feel I still have enough gas in the tank to work full time then somewhere like Belgium or Geneva. If I'm ready fror semi-retirement then Lisbon, the Algarve, the Canary Islands or something similar. Sunshine and a lower cost of living is the ticket in that scenario 

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 I would opt for the Canaries with it's year round sunshine...not sure if there is enough work there to sustain someone in semi retirement.

What do you do Barksdale (yep, I am very nosy)