Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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I don't think Europe can rely on America for anything at the moment....not with that self-serving megalomaniac in charge.

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 I don't think Europe needs America.

 

Why should we fund Europe's defense when they wont?.

 

Why is the American taxpayer supposed to pay to defend Europe and the American soldier should be bleeding?

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 Why?

Because that's how America got global influence and power but obviously they no longer want that and are handing it all over to China.

Thanks America we are now seeing the construction of Eurasia that will dwarf Americas past hegemony.

Just Canadas leaving you is going to have huge impacts on the American economy despite you saying you need Canada for nothing.

Trump obviously doesn't agree with your assessment as he's willing to start a war with them to steal their country... must be pretty important.

jackb wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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I don't think Europe can rely on America for anything at the moment....not with that self-serving megalomaniac in charge.

---

 I don't think Europe needs America.

 

Why should we fund Europe's defense when they wont?.

 

Why is the American taxpayer supposed to pay to defend Europe and the American soldier should be bleeding?

---

 Why?

Because that's how America got global influence and power but obviously they no longer want that and are handing it all over to China.

Thanks America we are now seeing the construction of Eurasia that will dwarf Americas past hegemony.

Just Canadas leaving you is going to have huge impacts on the American economy despite you saying you need Canada for nothing.

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 And what has that global influence got us?

36 trillion in debt

124%debt to GDP 

2 trillion in added debt just last year.

1 trillion in interest payments alone last year.

We should be trading with other countries, not paying for their national defense..

jackb wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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jackb wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

---

Syl wrote:

---

I don't think Europe can rely on America for anything at the moment....not with that self-serving megalomaniac in charge.

---

 I don't think Europe needs America.

 

Why should we fund Europe's defense when they wont?.

 

Why is the American taxpayer supposed to pay to defend Europe and the American soldier should be bleeding?

---

 Why?

Because that's how America got global influence and power but obviously they no longer want that and are handing it all over to China.

Thanks America we are now seeing the construction of Eurasia that will dwarf Americas past hegemony.

Just Canadas leaving you is going to have huge impacts on the American economy despite you saying you need Canada for nothing.

---

 And what has that global influence got us?

 

36 trillion in debt

124%debt to GDP 

2 trillion in added debt just last year.

1 trillion in interest payments alone last year.

 

We should be trading with other countries, not paying for their national defense..

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 Your debts are through greed and incompetence.

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 Our debts are the result of spending too much money on stupid shit we can't afford..

Syl wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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I don't think Europe can rely on America for anything at the moment....not with that self-serving megalomaniac in charge.

---

 I don't think Europe needs America.

 

Why should we fund Europe's defense when they wont?.

 

Why is the American taxpayer supposed to pay to defend Europe and the American soldier should be bleeding?

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 Because the UK, which is part of Europe, and America have always been allies. Trump seems to want to break this.

He has just said Zelenskyy doesn't want peace, and America wont put up with him much longer!!  

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 We haven't always been allies. And besides, you're not under attack. 

 

You keep ignoring my question. Why doesn't Europe fund it's own defense. Why should Americans pay far more to defend Europe than some person in France or Germany?

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 We are not under attack but Ukraine is, and Trump seems more interested in making deals with the enemy than defending a European country at war.

We help fund our own defence and we are set to give more, I have no idea what other countries give, probably a lot less. I guess some smaller countries can't afford to give as much.

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 Norway could pay a great deal more and they have profited nicely from the Russian oil embargo.

And why don't you have an idea what other countries have (or haven't) spent? 

The defense of Ukraine requires money and many of our allies haven't stepped up, outside of some bullshit about "standing" with them.

Words are cheap and they dont put Russian soldiers in body bags..

Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

We are not under attack but Ukraine is, and Trump seems more interested in making deals with the enemy than defending a European country at war.

We help fund our own defence and we are set to give more, I have no idea what other countries give, probably a lot less. I guess some smaller countries can't afford to give as much.

 Norway could pay a great deal more and they have profited nicely from the Russian oil embargo.

And why don't you have an idea what other countries have (or haven't) spent? 

The defense of Ukraine requires money and many of our allies haven't stepped up, outside of some bullshit about "standing" with them.

Words are cheap and they dont put Russian soldiers in body bags..

  I'm not in charge of any countries budget, whether I know the figures or not is inconsequential.

Syl wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

We are not under attack but Ukraine is, and Trump seems more interested in making deals with the enemy than defending a European country at war.

We help fund our own defence and we are set to give more, I have no idea what other countries give, probably a lot less. I guess some smaller countries can't afford to give as much.

---

 Norway could pay a great deal more and they have profited nicely from the Russian oil embargo.

And why don't you have an idea what other countries have (or haven't) spent? 

The defense of Ukraine requires money and many of our allies haven't stepped up, outside of some bullshit about "standing" with them.

Words are cheap and they dont put Russian soldiers in body bags..

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  I'm not in charge of any countries budget, whether I know the figures or not is inconsequential.

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 I didnt say you were in charge.

Do you think other countries (especially those in the region) should meet their obligations? 

Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

We are not under attack but Ukraine is, and Trump seems more interested in making deals with the enemy than defending a European country at war.

We help fund our own defence and we are set to give more, I have no idea what other countries give, probably a lot less. I guess some smaller countries can't afford to give as much.

---

 Norway could pay a great deal more and they have profited nicely from the Russian oil embargo.

And why don't you have an idea what other countries have (or haven't) spent? 

The defense of Ukraine requires money and many of our allies haven't stepped up, outside of some bullshit about "standing" with them.

Words are cheap and they dont put Russian soldiers in body bags..

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  I'm not in charge of any countries budget, whether I know the figures or not is inconsequential.

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 I didnt say you were in charge.

 

Do you think other countries (especially those in the region) should meet their obligations? 

-- Edited by Maddog on Monday 3rd of March 2025 07:21:17 PM

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 I think other countries should step up more, as we have done.

I certainly don't think any country should be pulling out.

Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

We are not under attack but Ukraine is, and Trump seems more interested in making deals with the enemy than defending a European country at war.

We help fund our own defence and we are set to give more, I have no idea what other countries give, probably a lot less. I guess some smaller countries can't afford to give as much.

---

 Norway could pay a great deal more and they have profited nicely from the Russian oil embargo.

And why don't you have an idea what other countries have (or haven't) spent? 

The defense of Ukraine requires money and many of our allies haven't stepped up, outside of some bullshit about "standing" with them.

Words are cheap and they dont put Russian soldiers in body bags..

---

  I'm not in charge of any countries budget, whether I know the figures or not is inconsequential.

---

 I didnt say you were in charge.

 

Do you think other countries (especially those in the region) should meet their obligations? 

-- Edited by Maddog on Monday 3rd of March 2025 07:21:17 PM

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 I think other countries should step up more, as we have done.

I certainly don't think any country should be pulling out.

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 It looks like you might be getting half your wish..

 

After decades of not meeting their obligations several countries are stepping up (still not all of them)..

 

Should have done it years ago and we probably wouldn't be here..

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 I agree.  The UK and Europe have never been so weak and lame.

Maddog wrote:

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Digger wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

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Syl wrote:

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Maddog wrote:

---

Syl wrote:

We are not under attack but Ukraine is, and Trump seems more interested in making deals with the enemy than defending a European country at war.

We help fund our own defence and we are set to give more, I have no idea what other countries give, probably a lot less. I guess some smaller countries can't afford to give as much.

---

 Norway could pay a great deal more and they have profited nicely from the Russian oil embargo.

And why don't you have an idea what other countries have (or haven't) spent? 

The defense of Ukraine requires money and many of our allies haven't stepped up, outside of some bullshit about "standing" with them.

Words are cheap and they dont put Russian soldiers in body bags..

---

  I'm not in charge of any countries budget, whether I know the figures or not is inconsequential.

---

 I didnt say you were in charge.

 

Do you think other countries (especially those in the region) should meet their obligations? 

-- Edited by Maddog on Monday 3rd of March 2025 07:21:17 PM

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 I think other countries should step up more, as we have done.

I certainly don't think any country should be pulling out.

---

 It looks like you might be getting half your wish..

 

After decades of not meeting their obligations several countries are stepping up (still not all of them)..

 

Should have done it years ago and we probably wouldn't be here..

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 I agree.  The UK and Europe have never been so weak and lame.

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 The UK has always met the NATO obligation of 2% of GDP being spent on defense. Most countries haven't..

 

Perhaps if someone had said "either meet the obligations you agreed to or we are kicking you out of the club", we wouldn't be here. 

 

Instead they were allowed to be slackers while the US taxpayer picked up the tab. 

 

What's worse, this isn't our backyard. If Europeans aren't interested in properly defending their region why should we? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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 I totally get that.